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over $250,000 per year. a group of top ceos, they were encouraged. my next guest says raising tax rates will stifle business growth and cost jobs. good to have you with us. >> good to be here. lou: this president wants new taxes. that is a heck of an initial
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rgaining position. >> the president talks about tax rates. he wants tax rate increases, and the converse that into dollars. the real question is can you raise tax revenue? the onlway we will raise a teeseven of revenue is private sector growth, and you're not going-private sector growth of your tongue the private sector you will raise their taxes, raise their health care costs, raise their energy ost and raise their labor cost. people are going to invest. you will find the kind of job creation you need. american businesses want this president to succeed. the one him to succeed because his success is tied to my success. conversely, his success is tied to the success american business. there ought to be some common ground. i'm just not seeing it. lou: what do you think of the idea that a dozen ceos show about the white house to talk big with the big guy, but small business that creates most of the jobs in this country not represented.
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these cuts represent a fraction of our economy. they have a major, major portion of the lobbying efforts and the pressure that is applied in washington. what is your reaction? >> these are good people, smart people, intelligent. but you really have to look at how rare motivated differently than small businesses would be. these large businesses can be the subject of government actions. it's easy to kid of select them, move them out. they can be subject attack. they also are sometimes subsidized. i have to worry about subsidies, and that may have government contracts. small businesses aren't concerned with those things. small-business can make a much better case to the president as to what needs to be done in this economy to create jobs. what would it take for small businesses, businessman women to create jobs and grow the economy? he just is to ask. i think he would get a very consistent answer. he does need to keep talking to
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the same high-leve executives that he has been talking to. tony's to get down into levels and talk to small businessmen women lou: let's you and i get to some brass tacks. we are talking about raising the top rate. we're being dragged along. talking about almost 40 percent, raising the top rate to about 40%. we already see the top 2 percent paying about 50 percent of all texas. i don't know what the impact would be, but i do have the sneaking suspicion that the president is not aware that the fact is, individual tax payments to this government have risen by 25 percent under the bush tax rates over the past two years. and the real answer is staring m and everybody else in the face. that is, growth. >> yes. private-sector growth is the only way of this. the governrnment has done
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everything it could possibly do. 800 million in stiulus, interest rates in zero, printing money and it is going in a style. the government has done what it can do. many the private sector. that tax rate, you're not adding in the obama increase in petrol taxes. it's over 40 percent. that it's all businesses, subchapter s corporations, elsie's. the larger corporation, th corporate tax rate goes down. that makes them feel good. the businesses that will be hit by these tax increases are the very small and midsize businesses that create jobs same people that get hit with obamacare, the energy increases, and a labor cost increases. lou: what if i told you that it makes some sense. give him at the margiwhat he wants on taxes. whether that's on investment tax , camping deductions.
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basically what mitt romney was proposing. get that done. then say what you going to do? you going to still be left if you roll all of that up. you will still be left with a huge deficit. it's going to have to mean cutting the federal budget. >> even if we increase the tax rate he top 1 percent in th country makes seven timbers of the income. 37 percent of the taxes. so a fair share argument really is it -- lou: you're getting a again start out here. your last shot. >>r. president, please, please work with the business community. we want you to succeed, but you're putting impedimets in our way and make impossible. we want you
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♪ lou: well, the president wants to raise taxes by over one half trillion. that is his opening gambit, initial bargaining position on the fiscal cliff. he wants to do that over the next decade. this is the kind of math i like. that works out to 160 million per year in taxes.
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republicans howling about it, but are they wrong to be so upset? let's take a look of some members. earlier this year the prident unveiled a three. eight -- i love this. we talk about these numbers that there is nothing to them. he forecasts a 1.3 trillion dollar deficit. so that means, if i can figure this out, to a half trillion dollars to work with. $901 billion next year. our national debt is now over $16 trillion. everybody knows that. and the president's big plan, he wants 16 trillion in the taxes. here is how he wants to get
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there. he wants to raise 849 billion over ten years by allowing the bush tax cuts, there they go, away on thevery first of december of this year. it will expire without call to of households with incomes one and 250,000. hundred 49 billion includes 206 billion in higher taxes and dividends. 123 billion on limiting itemized deductions. higher taxes on capital gains. the white house wants to raise another $584 billion over ten years, 584 billion of that over ten years by reducing the vlue of certain tax breaks, cutting tax breaks with his charitable contributions, mortgage payments. that might have an impact on the housing industry. that should give everybody a little excited. something good going here, as the saying goes in the housing
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industry. let's squash that. the rest of the president's money would come from several places, les get srious for a moment. that breaks down to $160 billion each year. that still leaves a hole of $840 billion if we want to balance the budget the president's -- here looking at a $1 trillion deficit. president likes to demonize the bush tax cuts. he won't tell you this, but i will. the tax revenue is already increasing to the federal government under the bush rates. in fact, individual income tax payments have risen
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$2,303,000,000,000 over the course of the past two years, up 26%, 26%. by the way, raising the marginal tax rates is a sure recipe for recession an even bigger deficits according to the congressional budget office. that was in part of this news conference. conference. so far it [heartfelt country music] ♪ - ♪ she stands in ♪ the face of evil ♪ and will not ♪ lose hope or faith
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♪ america ♪ the land freedom ♪ is still the home ♪ of the brave ♪ so raise the banner - ♪ raise the banner - ♪ called ol' ory - ♪ called ol' glory - ♪ let us join ♪ our fellow man - ♪ our fellow man - ♪ history ♪ will write the story ♪ america - ♪ america - ♪ will always stand ♪ history ♪ will write the story ♪ america ♪ will always stand ♪
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hey, yo, check out this chef, right? right? that's so gay. that's really gay. dude, look at those pants. please don't say that. what? don't say that sosomething is gay when you mean that something is dumb or stupid. it's insulting. it's like if i thought this pepper shaker was stupid, and i said, "man, this pepper shaker is
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so 16-year-old boy with a cheesy mustache." just saying. lou: president obama meeting with heads of the labor union todawho say the president is committed to higher taxes on top earners saying the rich don't pay their share. tomorrow a group of ceos will
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meet with the president, someof them also members of the campaign to fix the debt movement pushing for a long-term plan to fix our debt and deficit. joining me now in th on the cous most thoughtful, political economic thinkers, george gilder, also the author of the "israel test," just released today. >> i it is great to be here. lou: let's start some politics. i think rationally so. we are faced with economic calamity if our politics don't work here. what would you put the odds at that busy rationality and effectiveness reemerge from washington, d.c., on the fiscal cliff? >> zero. lou: i thought that. >> if we can keep the current tax rates, we would continue to increase government revenue.
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ineasing 26% under the bush tax rates over the last two years. over the last two years, government revens have risen 26%, almost a quarter using the buss tax rates. low tax rates brg more revenues, not less revenues. lou: do you interpret all of the drama to be a lack of faith? in front of the growth model that has been demonstrated, as you point out, over the past two years. they are really saying the economy cannotrow fast enough to support the government. we will not see revenue increase unless we raise taxes. >> that is correct. the pre-verse thing is you don't get growth if you raise tax
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rates. in california d several other states that top rate is approaching 50% effectively with a 50% top rate, a business have as much incentive to fire somebody to lower-cost as to hire somebody to increase revenues. lou: it is a high risk experiment, but nonetheless experint bringing tax levels above 50%, the nation right now getting ready to move higher. are we going to see california behave as the canary in the coal mine, if you will, when it comes to economic growth and the ability to support an ever-growing government? >> of course. people are just fleeing california. california is what happens to countries that raise their tax rates. entrepreneurs flea and welfare
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recipients flee in and you have an unsustainable state of affairs, and that is california, unsustainable. and silicon valley is america's greatest asset, the source of all of our technology and ultimately our military power and potential for growth and we are settling into over the pale, everybody in silicon view is angling for green subsidies and it is a tragedy. lou: that tragedy compounded by the fact the money that has been spent by this administration if you will on venture money li solyndra has been disastrous. >> they are twisting our venture capitalist, turning people like john doerr into a blithering idiot. john seeking government subsidies.
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he now wants us to support him rather than him to support the country with wonderful new companies like intel. lou: john is being adaptive to new realities. the primary source of the capital, he is turning to it, i suppose. i want to turn to this book, "the israel test." you take up the issue of the world civilization, importance of israel within it. as a capitalist as well as jewish state. you really believe that israel is that strong, that important in the world's future? >> i certainly do. the american economy is heavily dependent on israel today, partly because of the debauchery of silicon valley, but now israel is a crucial source of new technology for apple. all apples, flash tribes, just bought a new israeli company to empower its new technologies.
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microsoft, cisco, johnson and johnson. the dependent on technologies that come from israel. they're deeply dependent. obama seems to think that the the tips is more important in israel or turkey is more important. israel is the most importan technology force in the world next to the united states, and if we keep on our current path israel will be number one. lou: always good to talk with you. you.
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aah! learning how to kick flip 6 stairs takes determination. so will getting into college. i've got what it takes. so do you.
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man: constant tingling in my toes. woman: i had double vision. woman: they said, "you have multiple sclerosis." man: i kind of had to get a grasp on reality. man: i had to adapt and change very rapidly. woman: i had to learn how to drive with my hands -- yeah, that was interesting. man: a symptom may cause you not to be able to do that anymore, and at one point, i was able to do any of those. man: since i've been cycling, it's definitely helped my walking. woman: it's a fantastic opportunity to be working together with a common goal of curing ms, and sharing is the key.
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